Regional Affordability Committee Meeting Transcript – 08/07/2019 Title: City of Austin Channel: 6 - COAUS Recorded On: 8/7/2019 6:00:00 AM Original Air Date: 8/7/2019 Transcript Generated by SnapStream ================================== [10:10:52 AM] >> Good afternoon. My name is Delia Garza. We have a quorum so I'll call the meeting to order at 10:10. We're in the boards and commission room in city hall. Today is August 7, Wednesday. Before we take up our agenda items, I want to welcome commissioner cook, our newly appointed member representing Williamson county. Thank you for being here. Yay. [Applause] Our first item is approval of the minutes from the last meeting. I'll entertain a motion to approve those minutes. A move by sherry, seconded by commitment all those in favor say aye? Aye. That's one, two, three, four -- ten. Yay, we have ten. That passes 10-0. The next item is citizens [10:11:53 AM] communication and I don't think there's anybody signed up for citizens communication. And then item 3 is a briefing and discussion on best single source plus program. Are there speakers besides the ones giving the presentation? I don't think there are. Come on up and introduce themselves. I asked for this presentation because I had a meeting with the program and I actually wasn't aware of all the amazing things that this program is doing, and in fact I was just at a breakfast at U.T. Where somebody was saying that our nonprofits, they thought that our nonprofits don't do as good a job as they should at collaborating, and I said, well, actually, many of our nonprofits collaborate and I gave this program as an example of that. So thank you for being here. >> Well, thank you for having us. And I'm Jo Quinn, CEO at caritas of Austin, the lead and fiscal agent for the [10:12:55 AM] best single source plus collaborator. >> Hello, my name is Kia N fisher. I'm the best single source plus program manager at caritas of Austin. >> Ab thank you so much for inviting us to make this presentation and to your point about nonprofits collaborating, especially I would say in the area of homelessness, homeless services. I should be able to give you a number of collaborative meetings I attend in any given week. It gets exhausting after a while because collaboration in a lot of ways it's easier to do it yourself, but it's a whole lot better to do it as a collaborative and we are very committed at caritas of Austin to be collaborative across the system to make sure that we are achieving efficiencies and that it's working well [10:13:56 AM] for clients across the community. So you can -- just a little history. Best single source plus existed -- has existed since 2005. It was best single source at that time, and in 2010 I believe is when we added the plus to the best single source plus. I lose track of exactly the timing of that, but my point is this collaboration has been around for a long time, has been working together essentially with the same partners, a little bit of movement within the partners, but mostly the same partners for all that time. We have increased from initiating partners to 12 partners. It has a long history and a history of excellent service and always evolving and improving to do our work better. [10:14:57 AM] You can go to the next slide. Oh, okay. Awesome. Now which button do I push? >> [Inaudible]. >> Okay. All right. Before best single source -- and actually I'm going to show you, it is efficiency for all, but I'm going to get these in a little different order. I'll go back to that one in a minute. This is what our system looked like before best single source came into existence. And the reason that the CEOs who started the collaboration started it is because our clients, a client who, for instance, couldn't pay their rent would literally go to numerous agencies to get a tiny little bit of money and piece together the rent. In the meantime, you know, usually carrying a child on their hip, riding the bus, [10:15:58 AM] it was really, really difficult for clients, and often they would lose their job in the process, which is counterproductive to them paying their rent. And so the CEOs of the organizations who are the basic needs providers at the time said surely we can do this better. And they designed instead of this chaos that you see on this slide, they designed that, which is the client is in the center and we as a system revolve around the client and the client's needs so that everything is very client centered. And the way best single source plus works is if a client, for instance, is receiving services from any baby can because of a child with special needs, and in the process of getting that service it becomes apparent that the family has either become homeless or is about [10:17:00 AM] to become homeless, any baby can, who is a partner in bss plus, can just access the bss plus program to support that family. Before bss plus, the family was being referred out of any baby can to get that housing resource. Now they can get that resource within their best single source for service. Which is why we have our name. So back to the slide that says efficiency for all, you know, it works -- not only does it work better for the clients, it works really a lot better for our service providers too. Because no longer do we have to follow up to be sure that the client got, you know, that we referred over to a different agency, actually got in. The client can just be followed in a very seamless way and holisticly provided services. [10:18:03 AM] And we are very proud that 12 of Austin's leading nonprofits are members of the best single source plus collaboration, and everyone has very high standards for their services and they are great partners and we all work very well together. So a little about the need, the community need. Just a high level, 46% of renters in Austin and Travis county live in what we call cost burdened housing. That means they are paying more than 30% of their monthly income on rent. And what we really know to be the case is that actually very few families are paying 30%. Most people are paying 50 to 75% of their monthly income on rent. It's just, you know, a disaster waiting to happen. And families go without [10:19:05 AM] medication, they go without food in order to keep a roof over their head because of the pressure on the housing -- we all know how -- how expensive housing is because we're all paying for our housing here. That's something we can all relate to. And then the number of homeless people, we are seeing that, and actually this is the 2018 number that's on the slide and I want to update you. The 2019 number is a little up from the 2,147. It's 2,255 if you want to make that correction on your copy. And then the -- the cost of homelessness, we often talk about the cost of housing, which is very expensive, but let me just say the cost of homelessness is much more expensive than the cost of housing. The public services that people who are homeless access are the most expensive services we as -- [10:20:06 AM] you as public entities provide to both the county and the city. And the average annual cost of someone experiencing chronic homelessness is $222,000. So that -- you can kaching that every year, $220,000. So a program like best single source plus that prevents people from entering homelessness and takes people out of homelessness is going to impact that number over time, and we're going to get better and better as a community as we are able to scale services like what bss plus offers. So where are we? We are, I think, not surprisingly in our highest [10:21:06 AM] concentration of clients is in what we are all very familiar with as the eastern crescent. And it shows that on this map. And this is where the bulk of our clients, you know, seek services. And was either their last place that they lived or where they are currently living when we serve them. >> Do you want us to hold questions until the end? >> What would you prefer? >> That's fine, you can ask questions as we go. >> I'm kind of curious because some of the -- at least the zip codes that where we see some of this data, the county are further to the east. Is like the pflugerville area not included because they provide their own city services or you just don't have as large a concentration of people serviced in that area. >> That's a good question. >> I would say we don't have [10:22:09 AM] as large a concentration. We have served in the last year we have served the families as north as pflugerville and round~rock, if they are still in the Travis county sections. And even cedar park often. So it's just where the concentration of services is being provided. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Go ahead. >> Any other questions about the map? >> I have one. As far as -- as far as the single source, how does this work with housing counselors and housing counselors being aware? >> Tell me a little about what you mean about a housing counselor. >> Those individuals who have jobs or part of their jobs, whether it is with a nonprofit or public sector, but typically with a nonprofit helping people find housing. >> I'm going to let Kiana speak to that. [10:23:09 AM] Weall them case managers in our context. >> Some of them are case managers, some go by housing counselors. Doing the same work, I think. >> Absolutely. So we have -- we have case managers that are providing services at each of the partner agencies. >> Uh-huh. >> And so they work -- as a collaboration we work together to make sure there's a standard of service that they are providing and that they are complying to the services of the grant. And so what they do is they will work with a client to have them come into the program, really do a needs assessment what services they need. If it's -- if they are doing homeless prevention, let's say they've lost a job or they've had a medical expense, and so we really just need services related to that -- to paying the rent for a month or paying the utilities. [10:24:09 AM] >> My question is a little more specific. >> Okay. >> And it gets to those who actually assist clients in finding housing when they are in need of housing. How do they coordinate? How do they access what housing is available? >> Got it. >> With 211. >> So what we have is a collaboration. We have two landlord outreach specialists. We have two staff that work directly with case managers at all 12 agencies to connect them to affordable, safe housing units all over the city. So -- >> Okay. >> We're training case managers to do that work themselves, but they also have the resource of our landlord outreach specialist that will work and collaborate with property managers and landords all over the city. >> I would love to speak with you more about the landlord outreach individuals. >> I would be interested in [10:25:09 AM] that as well. >> It's a key component. We've learned -- >> [Inaudible]. >> We've learned over the years, we haven't always had the landlord outreach component as a part of bss plus, and I guess after 2010 we learned how important that resource is because in addition to working with the case managers, they are constantly developing relationships with the property management community and that's -- it just makes all the difference in the world in making units accessible for our client populations. >> I don't know if we want to discuss this further or -- >> Sure, go ahead. >> How many individuals are on this landlord outreach team? >> Two. >> Two. Uh-huh. >> That's what I heard. And -- and how -- are they keeping a data base of landords and apartments? >> Yes. We have a running -- a working spread sheet of landords and property managers that are willing to rent to our clients. [10:26:10 AM] That shows what side of town, what are the eligibility requirements for that property, but also kind of the process. And our landlord outreach specialists help the case managers and the clients walk through the process of applying for those units. >> Just curious, and you may not know this, but of those units, are there some that would accept individuals who have a criminal record? >> We do. >> You do, okay. >> But the landlord specialists really work with property managers to -- that are going to work with people that have barriers to traditional housing. >> Uh-huh. >> So there's opportunities for those. And that's a lot of what the landlord outreach specialists do and their fostering those relationships. Just because somebody has a criminal record or has had an eviction or doesn't mean [10:27:10 AM] they are not going to be a good tenant. >> That was going to be my next -- eviction, more than one child. >> Absolutely. >> Voucher? Do they all accept vouchers? >> They don't all, but absolutely. >> I think I'd like to -- this is probably an off-line conversation because I'm interested in the menu of services because we are talking about the echo project yesterday. And they contemplate having some multi-family, you know, a number of families in one place, but then a more decentralized process as well. And it's not really the bricks and mortar that I worry about as much as the programming that's necessary to address legitimate issues. >> The wrap-around services. >> Absolutely. >> So I'm interested in the menu of services and how you capture the data, how you refer -- your output data [10:28:11 AM] versus your outcome data, how long you've been tracking. So I'm just interested in the infrastructure and how you keep your data. >> We're getting ready to get into those slides. Perfect segue. To answer your question about the menu of services, it varies between our partners because obviously each partner serves a different niche population. So your menu of services is going to be different than the menu of services at caritas. Just keep that in mind. But a standard that we have within bss plus regardless of what your other menu of services is is that the case managers are required to do what we call Progressive engagement. Depending on the acuity level of the household that we're serving at the time, the -- the level, the intensity of the services is calibrated based on the acuity of the client and the [10:29:12 AM] household. And then it is adjusted as the client becomes more and more stable. But the case managers are required, and we set a standard of a certain level of engagement at the beginning of the case to be sure, especially if someone is being housed from the streets straight into housing, that can be an adjustment and it requires lots of hand holding and what I say a little tlc for the client, a lot of tlc for the client, and all of the menu of services is based on what the client's needs are. And that's the case manager's job is to be sure that that client has the level of support that they need. And the goal is, the single solitary goal is to be stable in housing. They are going to have other needs and we will meet those needs over time, but the -- [10:30:15 AM] until they are stable in housing, we can't really get to the other things. >> I get where you are going precisely there. My interest is the number of clients that a case manager can address effectively. >> Right. >> Meaning what's the proper ratio. >> Yes. >> Is there a proper ratio? Does the menu of needs dictate -- I might have seven needs and somebody else might have four. How do we determine the proper mixture of resources and then what types of skills are necessary to assign. Those types of things. >> Yeah, that's a really good question. And what we have found and what research shows us is that the - - the ratio is a little different between rapid rehousing or households that are receiving rapid rehousing [10:31:15 AM] services and then households that are receiving prevention services, homelessness prevention services. And so for households that are receiving rapid rehousing services, so they were literally homeless and through the program they are getting rehoused, that ratio is about 12 to 15. For a case manager to client. And for prevention, our prevention households are still receiving case management, but they are continuing to get case management and have someone goal set with them, make sure they retain those goals. For the homeless prevention household that is a little higher, 18 to 20. But the goal is to really to make sure that that household is getting -- is maintaining that housing stability, but also that [10:32:16 AM] community engagement. >> And one of our responsibilities as the lead and fiscal agent is to be sure that all organizations that are partners are meeting certain standards when it comes to the way the case management happens and all of the things that it takes to keep the client stable or in housing or to rehouse them. And, you know, it can be as nitty-gritty how quickly they are turning in their requisition for the rent check. It gets down to the granular details. As the lead fiscal agent that's our job is to be sure everybody in the partnership is keeping the client at the center and that everything is happening at a certain standard. >> Do you have a data base where you are tracking all this information? >> Yes. >> One of the problems we have at the county is we are frequently the rent assistance, utility [10:33:17 AM] assistance, food assistance provider of last resort. Do you all use county resources much? Do you access our rent, utility or food assistance much? >> No. >> Really? >> I'm sure that some of our organizations, you know, make referrals and at times we do make referrals to the county. We don't utilize that within best single source plus. And -- okay, I lost the first part of the question. >> I'm wondering about the collection of the data because we're having trouble, for instance, our utilization of rent assistance has increased dramatically at the county and we also increased the amounts that we provide for rent assistance. Smaller in the past and we've increased the dollar amount. But we are having, I would say, difficulty both tracking and then reconciling eviction data, which is very scattered and very hard to keep track of, [10:34:18 AM] with data related to people who we provide rent assistance to. We're literally trying to figure out among different systems are the people getting rent assistance then being evicted. If you all have a centralized calculate tracking so -- centralized data tracking. >> I think the county case managers are using homeless management information system which is administered by echo, the ending community homeless issue. We've always used that system science the beginning of the collaboration. >> Homeless management system. >> It's a single communitywide data base. We've been using it since 1998. And as a community, it's gotten better over the years. And it's a federally mandated -- it's federally mandated by hud that we utilize the homeless management information system. >> So you're not aware of [10:35:19 AM] some of your partner agencies might be utilizing the county rent assistance? >> Uh-huh. >> Because we see just in demand on our budget that it's gone up dramatically. Not just because of the individual per monthly payment amount that's been increased to the county, but the utilization as well. >> I think I can say pretty much with confidence that it would never be the case that a client that is enrolled in bss plus, that we would mix a payment from the county with a payment from bss plus because the resources we have within bss plus are enough to pay the whole rent. So we would not -- I mean that's kind of the whole point of bss plus is that we don't have to send them to extra resources, they can get their need met in one stop. >> That was my other question. Where do people go? They they access you by walking into a building or online out how to people get to that? >> We're getting to that. These are great questions. [10:36:19 AM] Y'all are right on it. So our effectiveness, we're very, very proud of our effectiveness and that's the next slide and it shows of all the people that exit to permanent housing or maintain their permanent housing, only -- I think it's -- okay, 84 out of 1,398 had some return to homelessness. So it's a very low percentage of people that lose their housing stability and have to seek services again. Yes. >> Do you attribute that to case management? >> Yes, 100%. >> Because you track until -- >> Right. Exactly. We call it the secret sauce. Case management. >> Do you do any training, provide training, say, in household management? >> Yes. >> Finances and educational opportunities? >> And different [10:37:19 AM] organizations in the collaboration have different resources there. At caritas of Austin we have a client education program that provides those kinds of life skills training. >> So the next slide -- >> I have a question on that. >>> Yes. >> What would you attribute the 84 that do return to homelessness? It's good it's low, but is there a pattern or just unforeseen circumstances? Personal circumstances that cause that. >> I can speak a little bit to that. I think that -- so we have been -- we have been tracking really specifically in the last two -- in the last year returns to -- returns to homelessness. And what we find is that -- or what the research has showed us is that oftentimes those -- those households are very rent burdened and [10:38:19 AM] don't -- and their income, they don't necessarily have ability to increase their income. >> Okay. >> And so we're seeing that. The other thing that -- that we're seeing is that they -- in some situations they need a higher level of intervention, a higher level of housing intervention. So while we serve them through the rapid rehousing intervention, they would be probably better served with a permanent supportive housing option. >> Okay. Thanks. >> And I have one quick question. >> Sure. >> A little bit off topic, but the families that have children, school-aged children, is there a collaboration with the school districts in terms of awareness for the district so that we can be tracking these individuals and make sure that they are receiving free and reduced or whatever [10:39:22 AM] services we would be able to provide as a means to fully capture those that are in need of additional support? >> We don't have any formal partnerships like that to share that kind of information, but we would certainly be open to having that conversation and that would be really, really helpful for our clients, I think. >> Yeah, I agree. >> So to your question, councilmember -- excuse me, commissioner Shea, the way we get our clients is through a coordinated entry. It is a communitywide assessment program that echo, again, ending community homelessness coordination oversees the entry system. And so everyone comes through the same door, so to speak, and they are all assessed utilizing the same tool. And that tool assesses them [10:40:24 AM] based their vulnerability to die on the street. And they are put in an order, a triage, they are triaged on that list and we utilize that list for choosing the clients that are in our -- on the literal homelessness side of our program. Where we're using rapid rehousing to get them rehoused. That's for the literally rehoused projects. For the clients on the -- I'm going to let Kiana answer that because I think that's not a straightforward answer. >> Yes, so those households we serve through housing prevention or homeless prevention, excuse me, we have as a collaborative have developed a homelessness prevention screening tool which all 12 of our partner agencies complete when they are assessing someone for that service. So this screening tool really seeks to capture [10:41:26 AM] those most in need of prevention services to avoid homelessness. So this tool, our homeless prevention screening tool, really captures the -- the likelihood that that household is going to enter the homeless system. And so what we're trying to do there is provide these funds and these services and this package to those that are most vulnerable to entering the homeless system. So we -- there are services -- and in the past bss plus has provided kind of eviction prevention, but what we're doing now is really homelessness prevention. So the most likely of those households enter the homeless system. And every agency takes referrals for homelessness prevention within their [10:42:27 AM] agency so any baby can was going to use their clients and catholic charities use their process of receiving clients, but they are all using the same screening tool. And then we as a collaborative work together to determine what's the threshold and what's the score and what trends are we seeing in the community, and we're letting that dictate how we serve. >> How do you -- how do you use that if someone is already living in their car and they show up at an agency? >> Sure, the agency can assess them and yeah, definitely do -- >> Do they still use the same tools, just [inaudible]. It's on now. So if they are already homeless, they pull out the assessment tool, what's the chance of you being homeless -- >> No, no, for the person living in their car, they would refer them to [10:43:28 AM] coordinated entry because they are literally homeless if they are living in their car. That's through echo. There's multiple sites crosser the city and there's a phone number you can call. You can do the coordinate entry assessment over the phone. It's very accessible. >> So before I ask this question, I will admit this might not be a smart question. But explain to me the difference between homelessness prevention and eviction prevention, because -- >> That's a great question actually. >> We've got a program that addresses helping folks through a docket that are being evicted and I'm wondering whether that is a group we should be working more closely with. >> I'm going to speak to it high level before Kiana gets into the details. High level nationwide because there's been lots of experts across the nation that have been studying the way we've been spending our money over the last 20 to 30 [10:44:30 AM] years trying to deal with homelessness, and what we've learned is that just because someone is going to be evicted doesn't mean they are going to become homeless. Okay? Some people have a soft place to land when they are in that crisis. Other people do not. And figuring out the difference between the person that has the soft place to land and the person that doesn't, who literally is going to land on the street, that's what all -- a lot of research has gone into creating this assessment tool that Kiana was referencing and we learned -- you know, there's different -- what's the word? There's different criteria that tell us, like for instance their income is a big one. If they are at literally the poverty level or below the poverty level, that's a huge indicator right there that they are not going to have a soft place to land before I get too more in that [10:45:33 AM] granular I'll let Kiana take it. >> No, and I think that's perfect. So what research has found is that if you are a household that is a little bit at profit level or a little bit -- poverty level or a little above, and you have social support or if you've -- some of the risk factors that you are going to become homeless, have you had a previous episode of homelessness in adulthood. Did you age out of the foster care system. Income is definitely another one of those really high indicators that you are going to become homeless. So this tool really helps us to focus on those households that are going to be -- that are going to enter literal homelessness. I think there's absolutely a space for that prevention eviction space, but as a [10:46:33 AM] collaborative, we've decided to focus the funding that we've been given through the city on homelessness prevention. >> I'm going to say it a little less politely than that. We have over the years spent a lot of money on families who will never become homeless and we've paid their rent and utilities when we could have diverted that money to ending homelessness for people. We just haven't been real smart about how we allocate our resources to the people who need it most. But we are getting smarter and smarter as we tend to do, and I know at caritas we've made in some ways painful decisions to stop doing that traditional rent and utilities and that's been a really, really difficult thing because that's been our bread and butter for a long, long time. And to divert the funds to say we're really going to target these funds only -- now that we can know who that is we'll utilize these [10:47:36 AM] tools to know who really needs our assistance rather than taking the chance that we're assisting someone who really doesn't need our assistance. In the end. >> That makes sense to me. I guess my question is who has taken that part of the continuum. You decided that is something that your 12 agencies don't do, but who is best equipped to deal with that because that, I think, is a partnership that can be created between Nick court and the group able to address that issue. >> Do you know if Travis county is using this homelessness prevention screening tool? They are not. So that sounds like we should have conversation with our folks. If you've determined you are helping people who really don't need your help because they are not in danger of homelessness, so you are no [10:48:36 AM] longer providing that short-term rent assistance, we should probably be asking similar questions. Is that a universal tool or one you tailored? >> We created it. We would be happy to share it. >> Have you had conversations with the Travis county folks who provide this rent assistance. >> No. >> Wow, there's no communication with you guys about this? Wow. >> We'll have to take you to lunch. >> We'll have an off- line conversation and I'll share some of the history about the involvement of the county and then and now. >> About of we move off this slide, so you've been able to increase the length of service from 12 to 24 months as well as increase the financial cap on assistance. >> Uh-huh. >> Which leads to a question about your current capacity versus your current enrollment and what happens as enrollment reaches or [10:49:38 AM] exceeds that capacity. What happens in those cases? >> That is an awesome question and that's something that we're constantly talking about as a collaborative. And to be super transparent, that's something as a collaborative we're looking at as it relates to scaling up and what it would mean to scale up and what it would mean to ask for additional resources. Because we are seeing people stay on caseload longer. Because that option to increase to 24 months, it really gives households the ability through their case manager and their case management to have someone to help them go through the - - the I got a job, I lost a job, go through the holiday season and have that support as they are -- so that they are not just trying to figure out by themselves. I would say that it has been [10:50:39 AM] awesome as far as service delivery having those 24 months option and having that increased financial assistance cap. I will say that we're serving less clients because of that. And I think that that's just a tradeoff. I think that we're going to continue to ask for additional resources to support what we know is working. >> Thank you. >> I want to be respectful of your time. We're taking a lot of your time so just feel free to tell me to speed up. >> Yeah, no -- >> [Inaudible]. >> You are right at the heart of why we're here. >> So our -- you'll see that our actual outcomes, this slide shows how our actual outcomes have exceeded the city of Austin goal that we have so we are very proud of that and I think it shows again the effectiveness of the collaboration and the methods that we're using. [10:51:42 AM] You know, we are serving less clients, and we've had a hard time sort of calibrating exactly as the cost of housing goes up and managing, but we know that we are serving those clients well. We're serving them very comprehensively. We would love to serve more clients, it just takes more resources, as we all know, everything is getting more expensive. So this is just another slide to illustrate the cost of homelessness versus the cost of actually housing people through the bss plus program. So the average -- I showed you the big number of, you know, like the most -- the highest user was the 222,000. But your average person experiencing homelessness that could be episodic homelessness is still $40,000 a year. [10:52:42 AM] That's still a pretty high ticket, versus our average cost per client is $11,461. So we're getting a lot of bang for our buck by actually housing people rather than allowing them to be in that very unstable condition. >> So you have a formula or a criteria that leads you to the $40,000 number? >> Yes. >> Okay. I'm very interested -- >> Based on public cost. >> Okay. >> So if I'm looking at these numbers, just to make sure I understand this, the 11,461 replaces -- if we can get somebody successfully through the program, that 40 becomes 11. >> Yes. That's the way to look at it. >> Wow. >> So it's not really -- you know, we talk about savings. It's not truly savings, it's more cost avoidance. [10:53:44 AM] And then here's another one. We like to toot our horn about saving everybody money. So, you know, if we -- we save about $82 million. That's over a year, is that right, Kiana? >> Uh-huh. >> Or we avoid $82 million in costs. And then here's another one just to illustrate the difference in the cost. And I think the most important slide is this one right here that shows all our partners. So you can see this stellar group of nonprofits who are participating in best single source plus. We're very proud to have everybody. What other questions do you have? >> I have a question. Do you go meet with the -- do you meet with them to [10:54:46 AM] pull them into the program, introduce the program or do they come to you saying I hear -- >> So we have a process. Currently we don't have enough resources to add a new partner, but if we were to get more resources, what that would look like is we would sort of put out an rfp, we would put out a public invitation for organizations to apply to become a partner. And then we have certain standards that partners need to meet in order to become a partner. And then we have a whole process that we go through before we say yes or no. >> So my understanding is the way the collaboration works is that you have an any baby can client that is -- was referred to them for specific issues that any baby can can address, but then you realize in a conversation with their any baby can caseworker they say they are about to get evicted and that's when they [10:55:46 AM] get into this kind of assessment tool and all that. But how does someone -- if someone is not working with any of these agencies but is about to get evicted, how would they get into the program? >> That's a great question. So I'll just speak about something that happens pretty regularly. So catholic charities often gets calls from the community about someone is experiencing -- is at risk of homelessness and got an eviction notice. And so they would call catholic charities, they would do the -- if they had capacity to help, if they have funds, then they would do the bss plus prevention screening tool. And if they were eligible for bss plus, then they would get enrolled, they would come in and do an intake and then they would have access to those funds [10:56:47 AM] and those -- that case management services. Any baby can is similar. Meals on wheels does a lot of prevention. So those -- the awesome thing about the collaboration is that bss plus doesn't replace any of those natural supports that are already community based. They just have access to our standards, to our support and to that funding that are already in those community based organization. >> I would say additional to that that catholic charities is sort of our point person on the general population of people who are unstable in housing. That's where we steer people. Because the other organizations are more niche organizations where they are not going to just accept the general population of people. >> Okay, so that's helpful. So, like for example, I could be approached by a [10:57:49 AM] constituent -- >> I'm sure you do. >> -- Who says my niece is about to get evicted. At that point catholic charities is who you could refer them to to get them into the program. >> That would be my suggestion. >> Unless they are -- if they are a -- so maybe it's not your niece, maybe it's your aunt and she's over 50 - - or 55 and so family elder care, which serves that very specific population, would be a good avenue for her. >> Or a victim of domestic violence. >> But any of the organizations, if anybody approached any of the organizations, they know who to refer. >> Absolutely. >> The person to. And then I guess -- thank you for the presentation. I'm sure people have more questions, and I wasn't aware of this so it was good to know, this is the largest public health contract, [10:58:49 AM] right? >> Yes. >> The city of Austin provides -- this is the largest public health contract. >> Uh-huh. And you are almost our only funder. We do have some funding from applied materials, they've been a partner from the beginning of the collaboration. We're very grateful for their partnership. And we used to get money from the county, nod, nod, wink, wink. We would love to partner again in the future. >> Does anybody else have any questions? >> So there's -- >> [Inaudible]. >> There's one number that I'm not sure is here. I'm trying to grasp the real need for your services in Austin and/or Travis county. I understand that there are 2,255 homeless persons, according to a recent census, but how -- what is the real need here? How many families are at [10:59:51 AM] risk of homelessness? Is that something that I missed in this presentation? >> No, and I don't know that number. >> And I don't think we -- we don't have that number. I think that we can look at the risk factors and we could hypothetical -- come up with hypothetical numbers just based on those risk factors that we do in the screening form, but I don't think we're capturing that information now. >> My concern if we're not capturing that information, how will we know how good a job we're doing at a community of meeting this need? Are we meeting the need of a large percentage R percentage of persons in this situation or is it still a small number that we're -- >> Can census data in 21 help. >> The community survey done with the census data is very helpful, and we can sort of guess, to what Kiana was saying, it's always been [11:00:51 AM] really difficult to get to the unmet need. Who is out there that's not getting served that doesn't know anything about this program. >> Unknowns. >> Yes. It's unknown. >> That would be the key is how many people who think they are at risk or know they are at risk know about this program. So I don't know how you would capture that, short of going door to door, hey, how is your financial situation, are you going to be evicted soon. So getting word out about this program and some of the benefits -- >> But they also don't have unlimited capacity. >> Right. >> And the other sort of dark truth about people getting into the program is that the people who are able to be first in line are often the people who don't need the service. And the people who need the service the most are the people who are unable to be [11:01:53 AM] first in line, who are unable to access. And so lots of outreach and the coordinated system is a key answer to that. >> And to me that's the more important part is those with the greatest need, how do we get them to the front of the line. >> Right. >> In the greatest numbers. >> How about new partners? Can you think of new partners that would be able to -- applied materials I think you mentioned. Other people, ways of getting additional support for that work that you do. What other partners would you reach out to? How would you do that? >> We have recently had an effort to reach out to to philanthropic community, with St. David's foundation. Those are going well. We don't have any real commitments yet. The episcopal foundation is very interested in our work as well. [11:02:54 AM] We're continuing to cultivate those relationships and we think that there's -- that the fill and tropic community would be very pleased with their investment -- philanthropic if they would get on board. >> We've just gotten a report from the folks that are putting together the pay for success program. I know the city is a big participant. I don't recall all the other -- I know central health is as well. Are you all partnering with pay for success? >> Not bss plus, but caritas of Austin is actuallyhe main partner in pay for success. We are. We were the first provider in the pilot. >> Oh, great. Because I'd actually thought -- is your data point about the average annual cost for the top 250 high cost homeless users of public crisis services, is that a total of 220,000 or 220,000 per person? >> Per person. >> I thought the numbers were much higher. I didn't realize it was per [11:03:56 AM] person. And then the -- is there, like, a public phone number? I think you had said -- >> For the coordinated assessment? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> So if you learn about someone who is in need of homelessness assistance, you can actually refer them to a phone number? >> Yes, you can. >> What is that number? >> I do not know. >> That would be useful for us to know. >> I will absolutely get that for you. I just don't have it here. >> I think that would be useful for everybody to know, if that's something you broadcast publicly. >> You used to be able to call 211, but I don't think anymore there's a collaboration between echo and 211. >> That what I asked if 211 was involved, the answer is -- >> There's an actual phone number we just don't have it in our head. >> Do you know why? I thought that was the single source phone number. >> I don't know why that is no longer a partnership, but [11:04:57 AM] it's not. >> Wow, that's -- >> Doesn't United Way -- >> Yes, United Way. >> And you guys don't partner -- I don't know. I -- >> United Way is not a partner with bss plus, but we're talking about coordinated entry. >> Because 211 is such an easy one to refer people to for all kinds of services. >> It's United Way and central health is part of it, they refer to us. >> Maybe we can talk further off line like what happened there because that seems like a logical link to connect. The final point is we at the county, we recently did a work session with technology leaders just to try and get a sense of what's coming in society with evolving technologies and what impact might it have on local government. And one of their top recommendations was that we -- we have a data scientist -- we have people at the county who do data, [11:05:57 AM] but that we make better utilization of these streams of data that are increasingly available about all kinds of things. And what strikes me in so many cases is we don't have -- either we don't have good data, it's not very complete or it's not being coordinated in terms of the analysis. And that sounds like a little bit of this here too, if we don't know the size of the problem. Because I've heard much higher numbers with regard to the numbers of homelessness in Austin and I realize it's hard to find people on the streets and count them accurately. >> And there are different methods of estimating how many homeless people we have. The point in time count. We know there are more than 2,225 people that are homeless. For one, we know right now there are about over a course of a year about 10,000 people seek services [11:06:57 AM] and are entered into the homeless management information system, so that's an annual number, 10,000. That's more of an accurate number. So that's either someone who is experiencing short-term homelessness or long-term homelessness. Those -- are those all literally homeless? Okay. So it's about 10,000 as a ballpark figure. >> And I would add, I don't have the tip of my fingertips, but central health certainly has data on the number of people who we see as far as health care who are homeless, and the number is quite large. And, of course, some of them are -- and their homelessness exacerbates this, in and out of our health care. But we serve those at 200% below the federal poverty level so we do have numbers on how many we're serving who are homeless and some of them, as I was saying, are, [11:07:57 AM] of course, repeats. >> Of the -- I don't know, commissioner Shea just asked this, but there's not a slide number, but it's this one where it talks about how you've exceeded the city of Austin goals. So it has a number there. It says -- so 288 were -- received services through the rapid rehousing and 385 -- no, 460 through the homeless. Do you know, was that the capacity? Were those capacity numbers and do you know, like, how many people were turned away? >> So I don't know the number that were turned away. I will say that each agency has their own capacity. So -- I'll say this. Each agency has their own capacity of client that they [11:08:58 AM] can intake. And while most of our partner agencies are doing both rapid rehousing and HP in some combination, agencies like catholic charities are doing all housing -- homelessness prevention so their capacity to move people through the process is going to be a little more than an agency like caritas of Austin that's doing primarily rap it rehousing. Their capacity looks different just based on the wrap- around services that are provided. >> Okay. If it were possible to know that number, you know, as we move into a budget where we are investing significantly more in homeless issues and to be able to articulate that, you know, yes, we've helped all these other people but there were 500 [11:10:00 AM] other people where we couldn't, and you guys are doing a great job reaching the doles so obviously the program is working so it's just a capacity issue. >> Yes. >> As we move into where I believe the social security security -- the city manager announced over 60 million in new homeless services. And I really appreciate the slides about, you know, where -- not necessarily cost savings, but how do you refer to them? >> Cost avoidance. >> I feel like those are the hardest to -- everyone wants numbers and metrics and I know I just asked for some, but the example I often give is teen pregnancy prevention programs, it's hard to know -- and we're seeing numbers significantly drop in teen pregnancy numbers, and so obviously those programs are working, but it's hard to calculate, you know, the quality of life of someone who we were able to prevent a teen pregnancy and how that could change their [11:11:00 AM] lives for in so many different ways and generations to come from that. So it's always hard to explain to the public, you know, why it's important to invest in these programs and the effects that -- the positive effects of these life-changing interventions. Go ahead. >> One last number I would like to share because according to that census because there are -- at least in Austin, the school year in the 2017-18 school year we count 2,301 homeless students that year alone in the district. 2,301 students. That information is at housing works austin.org. You will be able to see how many were unsheltered, community shelters, hotels and motels. It's mind blowing. Which gets back to my question wondering how many other students in the Austin ISD are at risk and [11:12:01 AM] surrounding districts, are at risk for homelessness. Appreciate your work. >> Sure. >> And I have -- go ahead. >> Just one. I realize the language can get a little difficult when you are talking about saving money versus cost avoidance. Another way to think about that would be the cost benefit analysis of doing this so we could probably come up with some numbers that -- that would show that. >> And they are not listed as a partner, but I'm just curious as to to collaboration between your organization and the V.A. Being a city and knowing a disproportionate number, do you coordinate with them at all? >> We have a V.A. Funded program within caritas and there are other organizations like front steps. Who else? >> Salvation Army. Front steps. [11:13:02 AM] They have a hud -- they have a permanent supportive program through H.U.D. Vash and they have transitional housing, a grant per~diem program, specifically transitional housing up to two years for people that are experiencing homelessness. >> Rapid rehousing. >> And they do rapid rehousing and they do veteran specific -- annual entry that is veteran specific homeless beds. >> There are some veterans that doesn't qualify for the program and those veterans can definitely access bss plus. >> Thank you. >> I guess one last -- so is the city contract funding the bss case managers as well as -- >> All of it. >> -- Each individual nonprofit? >> Uh-huh. It's one pot of money and we [11:14:03 AM] have, like, an administrative budget which pays for the salaries for the case managers and some other kinds of administrative costs. The biggest part of it, though, is the direct client assistance. And the way the collaboration works, which is a little mind boggling to most people, is that we have just one pot of money that we all share. And we access that pot of money on a philosophy that the money follows the need. And so each agency isn't, like, given an amount of money and they get to spend that however they want. We all share. When we have a need at our organization, we tap the pot of funding and we just monitor and that's why Kiana is probably starting to get gray hair is our bss plus admin team it's their job to monitor that pot of money constantly to see are we [11:15:05 AM] overspent, under spent, and to spend the money appropriately. So there's not -- nobody gets, like, an assignment of money for their clients. We make projections of what each agency will probably need. You know, we have methods and tools for sort of guesstimating, but if somebody has -- if an agency has just this run of clients, we serve them. If the money is in the pot, they get served. >> This is something often talked about and seldom implemented so thank you which is having a continuum of care and the funds following the clients. That's what you are saying the funds are following the clients. >> Exactly. This collaboration has operated like always and it requires lots of trust on the part of the collaboration, and I have to say our partners are just wonderful because we've just developed these very close relationships and when we come together, we meet a lot and that's the only way to do it is face to face, [11:16:06 AM] making it happen. >> So if, for example, I went to a presentation by -- I forgot the organization. The Austin -- it's like a collaboration of women who each give a certain amount and they give five scholarships. >> Impact Austin. >> And any baby can got, like, I don't remember, let's say $50,000. Do that put that 50 into y'all's pot or -- >> I'm sure they use that separately. >> Yes, it is. >> So it's not -- >> It's separate. >> It's the Austin public health contract. That is shared. >> Yes. >> Okay. Got it. So if somebody were to want to contribute, how would they become, like, a donor. Like applied materials, they just reached out. >> They would just reach out to caritas and write us a check. [Laughter] It's really icy. >> Well, -- easy. >> It's good to know. >> We would negotiate. [11:17:06 AM] There's a lot of distance between point a and point B on that check writing. >> Thank you, that was very helpful. Like I said when I had that meeting, I wasn't aware of all the good work and the collaboration and I wanted to make sure other people were aware of it too. >> Thank you for inviting us. This has been a pleasure. >> This was a fabulous presentation. I'm astonished that -- I was not aware that given all the work we do at the county on, you know, being the provider of last resort in so many instances, it's surprising to me this seems to be a somewhat well kept secret. >> I guess we're just to busy doing it, we forget to talk about ourselves in the community. Thank you and thanks to all of you for your public service on this committee. >> Thanks. >> [Inaudible]. >> The -- so apparently we don't have a presentation for the Austin tenants council, but this was on the -- and I believe we [11:18:11 AM] talked -- this was put together -- these are recommendations by the Austin tenants council. Policy recommendations and we talked about it last time. I believe it was commissioner Shea and commissioner Travillion who said there were things in here that were recommendations the county is already doing? And so I guess I would say, you know, we're welcome to have any discussion on any of these recommendation, but I don't know if -- maybe you can take this back to county staff and see what they have implemented. >> We'll take it to [inaudible]. >> Okay. >> [Inaudible]. The frustrating part there isn't a single place to gather that information and we've been trying with the constables, with the jps, with the county health and human services staff to try and just get an assessment of where we are. >> Okay. >> But actually if you want to put this on the agenda and we can let our staff know we're expecting an [11:19:11 AM] update on the issues that were presented and also on where things stand within the county on this issue. >> Okay. So can the committee staff just work with your office to know who is going to make that presentation? >> Absolutely. But that will give us further impetus. >> The other agenda item was 5 which was discussion on the priorities. We did this strategic little plan in 2016 and we talked about going through and seeing if there is any changes that want to be made. One thing that we pointed out was the reference to the land development code process, which obviously that has changed. So we can -- my office can update, make any -- what we can do for the next meeting is we can update areas of where city -- you know, some city processes changed and we need to make updates to that, but I don't know if anybody else has any [11:20:13 AM] recommendations on a different direction or if we want to convene and maybe, you know, spend, like, a work session just going through and seeing what, you know, discussions that we already have had or maybe, you know, seeing that we have actually addressed some of these areas in one way or another. >> I think it would be very helpful if your staff could send around a draft and just corrects anything that's not factually accurate anymore, such as the land development code. I think what we did last time was people kind of emailed back to your staff, is my recollection, I don't see the staff who I worked with on it, and -- and we compile those and then people had time to look at them and then we had kind of a work session and went back and came up with -- >> A final copy. >> That we sent out. [11:21:14 AM] >> Do you have anything? >> My question, the previous conversation on the Austin tenant, if we get some kind of stop report, what's the status. But the same with the regional affordability plan. I'm embarrassed as the new kid on the block knowing what it is we've done or not done. And if we have done some of these things, familiarize committee councilmembers on past efforts by city council to do this. That may have been done one or two years ago, but what does that mean for those of us here for one or two or three meetings. I would appreciate seeing some stoplight report for lack of better words to know where we're at on different items. >> Sure. And again, I mean it might be a little hard to -- there's been a lot of discussion and that's really [11:22:15 AM] what most of this committee is for is to have these discussions and to learn about different programs and learn how we can collaborate. But we have not and we can't take any -- committee want make any - - we can't make any ordinance changes for the different organizations, but we can go through and see, you know, I think there was discussions on, you know, let's see if I can find an example. Familiarize committee members on planning tools such as smart growth index. Let's say that was one that we had had a presentation on. Then, you know, I guess that's a point we can say we've done this, we've talked about the smart housing program. Okay. >> One question I had is, we certainly cannot, you know, make ordinances or policies for the other -- for any of the bodies on here, but we could make recommendations. So I guess I wonder if there's any of these where [11:23:16 AM] we should look through and see, given the information we have received or a future presentation such as the latest update on eviction-related policy recommendations, we've had numerous conversations on that or, you know, homeless if there's something where we should look to in the future with the time frame for making recommendations. I don't know. >> That's a good idea and I think some -- this is actually something I'm going to bring up in the future agenda items, but with revenue caps looming for many of our jurisdictions, you know, we're going to have to be budgeting differently. And so maybe there's an opportunity to make some kind of recommendations based on that and a big thing I think affects ain orderrability is, you know, transit and the fact that we don't have as a robust system as we -- as we could have and we're working on [11:24:17 AM] that at cap metro. And so I think there's also an opportunity to make a recommendation when the, you know, project connect issue comes -- you know, when we start talking about that more because there will likely be a big bond election in November 2020 about transit. So maybe those are some opportunities to add to here and update this. With recommendations or opportunities. >> Yes. >> Because I know that's helpful for our -- we do resolutions, that's part of the context that's behind whatever we're calling for in the whereas clauses and I think that adds a little teeth to it, whereas the regional affordability committee recommended, blah, blah. Anybody have any suggestions on the strategic plan? And, of course, updating the membership and all that too. Go ahead. [11:25:20 AM] >> The other thing that strikes me on page 2 it when speaks of progress report on a quarterly basis, it seems this group meets on a quarterly basis. This is introduction paragraph 1, last sense, committee will review progress quarterly. I take this to mean this committee will be looking at this document seeing what progress it's making or not. So I just -- I draw that to our attention as a possibility of revising this. The question whether we want to hold ourselves to that in the future. >> Good point. >> I concur because I think instead of doing a formal quarterly review, what the committee has been doing more of is tying back the presentations, the discussions we have to the strategic plan, but not with a formal review. >> Yeah, and that's actually what started this discussion I think like three meetings ago was the intent was to update the plan. [11:26:21 AM] That's why we've been talking about this plan with the attempt to update it. Soon. So homework assignment again. If you all can just take a look at it before our next meeting and email any suggestions and then my office will work on kind of a red line version, making corrections, making annotations of things that we worked on and then maybe also adding a going forward opportunities for recommendations for big items coming up or big issues coming up. >> Do they have these electronically? >> That's what I was going to suggest. >> Yeah. But I think what would be helpful is if we could receive an email stating the request to -- here's the electronic copy. If you want us to make track changes, which I typically [11:27:21 AM] do or otherwise, and give a deadline when you would like to receive them, if that kind of email was sent out to everyone it would be helpful. >> I know on the council level, and it may not be, but we can talk to legal staff, but there are sometimes -- not supposed to be like talking -- not that it's behind closed doors, but communicating with each other -- >> Quorum. >> You don't want a quorum. If we were all working on the same document, that's essentially a quorum. Let me talk to our legal staff and find out what is safe for us. >> Right, you don't want a walking quorum. It may be a send an email saying here's the draft, here's the deadline, email your suggestions to this person. Or whatever works legally. >> Or you could possibly work on the draft yourself and then bring -- we could bring it and -- >> Right. That's different than having a Google document every is working on at the same time. >> And the way we work on it at the county is we'll have it on a bulletin board or in [11:28:23 AM] a commonplace where anybody can go into that commonplace. >> And so we have a similar bulletin board, but the public has access to it and I don't know how we -- we don't have our own bulletin board that the public has access to for this committee is I guess part of the problem. Like our council bulletin board, each councilmember has access to it and the public can look at it too. So that's how we're able to avoid any possible quorum issues. But -- so we'll talk to our legal, see if a shared Google document presents a problem. My assumption it would, and if it does, then we'll set a deed line and ask to -- deadline and ask to look at the document and you can individually look at it. We can all come together at our next meeting and that would be a work session opportunity to work on it and update it. September 22nd. [11:29:29 AM] >> Say the date again. >> September 22nd. >> That's a Saturday. >> Oops. >> 25th. I see it on Wednesday, September 25th, regional affordability committee, 10:00 A.M. >> Sorry, my notes are wrong. Okay. So the 25th. Okay. And then aside from that, the only other agenda item is the future agenda items, and the one that I thought of that -- this happens when you show up -- (laughing) So there have been discussions because of revenue -- and I was actually going to -- I had thought about this before I saw Ms. Cavazos, but there have been discussions about some of our entities having revenue caps and some not and wondering if [11:30:30 AM] there's the opportunity for in areas where the city of Austin has funded things, where other entities that aren't having revenue caps can maybe -- can maybestep in and fund some of those things. If it's possible to maybe have a presentation by central health -- this will actually be after the city approves our budget, so -- and the good news we've heard, and I'll put that in quotes, is that this next budget won't be as hard as, you know, the budgets in about three or four years because we have the ability to go to the full 8% this last year. But in following years, we will -- there will be budget shortfalls, even adding no additional new programs. And I think many of the other organizations -- government entities do have government caps, in a similar boat. So please let us know if that's not something that central health could be ready for, but just the knowledge of if there are any [11:31:31 AM] shared opportunities, to absorb some of the areas that we have similar interest, in the under areas where central health could possibly fund. >> As far as central health, we -- I don't think that we would be in any position to do a presentation till after our budget process is completed. >> Uh-huh. >> So that's probably into October. So we'll go back and look at that. >> Okay. >> And then we will be in a position -- we will have adopted our budget, and we are going through lengthy discussions, given all of the increasing needs that we are encountering, you know, as the population grows, the need for our services continues to grow and there are many areas of community in [11:32:31 AM] need -- we have new clinics in eastern Travis county, but we also are finding greater needs in some specialty areas and health insurance, so -- but that would -- I think we wouldn't be in position to do that until after we had adopted our budget. >> Okay. And that might work out fine if the entire meeting is just a, would session because that's actually what we did last time, the whole meeting was -- >> Yes. >> - - Was us working on the strategic plan, and it did take -- I think it took, like, two or three meetings for us to -- >> It did. >> For us to form this, so... >> [Off mic] >> 25th. >> 25th. >> So we would not do the presentation -- we would not do the presentation from Travis county with the update on the eviction stuff? I mean, our staff may need more time than that. I just want to clarify. >> Yeah. That's a good idea. So just be a work session. Does that sound good to everyone? Come ready to participate. Does anybody else have anything they want to add? If not -- >> I'm happy to -- >> Before we adjourn -- [11:33:32 AM] >> So my question for this committee, with its focus on affordability, becomes if there's anything at all that we can do to help forward the conversation of using Austin ISD properties for affordable housing in Austin, currently the city of Austin is not building affordable housing for families which means we are projecting to lose 7,000 students during the next ten years come means we are going to have extra properties. If we were to achieve the efficiencies of say cyfer, we'd be closing 37 schools. I don't pretend Austin has the will to close 37 schools, but we have the opportunity to provide affordable housing. What does that mean for this committee? Is it something we are able to get behind and champion the building of affordable housing for families on these lots? >> I would have to push back that Austin isn't building affordable housing for families, in fact, we just approved a $250 million bond that is leveraged with significant community organizations like foundation [11:34:33 AM] communities that does build. A definition of family housing, you know, it can vary, but, you know, with almost every apartment complex that we approve, there are affordable units included in that that are at least two bedrooms, which, you know, family housing could be a one-bedroom apartment. So it's a conversation we can certainly have as we continue with the strategic housing plan, but Austin is contributing significantly to affordable housing, period, in my opinion. >> I misspoke, I apologize if I misspoke. My question is, will this committee be able to somehow get behind the use of school properties for affordable housing? >> Yes. I can't imagine we couldn't or we wouldn't. I know that there's a committee between aid -- is it Travis county and the city of Austin? >> Uh-huh. >> Where -- >> Yes. >> Councilmember tovo has done significant work in that area, and I can certainly ask her for her an update where they have -- [11:35:34 AM] I know they've had discussions on the property that's available and how that property can be used for affordable housing. So maybe we can ask someone from that committee to come give us an update on what they're doing and how they're including, you know, that -- the idea and how that's being pushed forward. >> I think that would be -- >> On that joint subcommittee, but this committee also -- >> Yes. >> -- Looked at how to utilize school district property for affordable housing and began a number of conversations, and then I think for financial reasons, the school district felt they had to put the property up for sale and raise as much money that way as they could. But, yes, this has been a focus for the joint subcommittee, and we've made some progress. It needs to be revisited. So I think that would be a good thing as well, to ask for an [11:36:36 AM] update and I've forgotten who from the city is the representative staff person to the joint subcommittee. Sarah -- Sarah Hensley. >> Okay. She's not here anymore. Sarah's gone. But we'll find who it is. >> So she left the city? >> Uh-huh. >> It is -- it is something, yes, that we have had discussions here before, and also, we've had discussions about getting some type of presentation. Maybe this could come. The joint subcommittee of available land that aisd has, city, county, whomever. And back to the point on housing for families, I'm on the housing investment review committee for neighborhood housing community development, and certainly part of the criteria that we look at in making recommendations is, are there units that are being subsidized that will serve families, you know, that have more than one bedroom, so it is certainly something that the city [11:37:37 AM] is looking at. >> Yeah. Okay. >> And do we have a date for the future meeting after September? >> Let's see here. Do we have the dates? September 25th, then what's the one after that? >> I was looking -- >> I've got it for November. >> November? >> November 20th. >> November 20th? >> Yes. >> Yes. November 20th is what I have. >> So let's count on a work session for the 22nd, and then -- and then we can talk about future agenda items. But I would say one for sure would be the update on evictions and then one could be the update on the joint -- the aisd, city, county, and the progress that's been made on the city-owned -- and could aid give a presentation on -- because I know that's been a topic of discussion on -- I mean, to your point, [11:38:37 AM] commissioner Shea, I thought that was part of the problem, is that once a facility becomes available, it is usually -- is it sold, as opposed to keeping it, or what's the dynamic there? >> Excellent question. So we need to declare property surplus, then after that, the challenges that we as a district cannot simply give away land that's been given through taxpayer money, so we have to find a way to get market value for that land. So the question for us becomes, is there a way for us to bring together the funds to be able to purchase these properties at market value, to develop affordable housing, and/or to, would with partners who are willing to assist in that respect. >> Okay. >> If we're asking the county to come and give updates on evictions, some of the same staff people are also staffing the joint subcommittee, so we might try and do the two in the same meeting. >> Sure. Okay. Let's do that for October. >> But if we -- if we're talking about what we would do with [11:39:38 AM] property -- >> Oh, sorry, November. >> -- We'd probably be talking about our corporate team, shields and [indiscernible] Because they'd be most responsible for the capital discussion, and possibly -- and possibly Deanna Ramirez because you'd have to think about it in the chapter 381 context or the corporations context, which would be more advantageous and probably require the chapter 380 staff from the city. >> We should go ahead with our staff that's been working on the housing issue jointly through the joint subcommittee, because three different jurisdictions have different rules, it's been a little lumpy. But I think they can bring in anybody else from the county that would need to be included. >> Another suggestion that I have along this vein, topic, would be to get an update from neighborhood housing community development and the housing investment review committee so that people can get an update on [11:40:41 AM] the bonds and, you know, different aspects of the criteria and other resources; and also one on an update on the affordable housing data portal. It's a project that I'm involved with, along with neighborhood housing community prompt and haca, the housing authority, city of Austin. I think those two would be helpful and they could be done together, I would think. >> Yeah. >> [Off mic] >> Terry, I hate to put you on the spot, but since we have your expertise, maybe there's an opportunity to talk about the difficulties it is to be a private developer and be able to offer subsidized housing and how it's usually a concern over density is where you get that affordability, because the expense of -- is mostly in the land, and I think -- >> [Off mic] >> Yeah. I think for some of our newer members, it's good to have that [11:41:42 AM] conversation about the -- how hard it is and -- to provide that affordable housing for our development community. As our city grows and we all know that we need more housing -- >> Part land cost and part construction cost. >> You want to turn your mic on? >> I'm sorry. It's part land cost and it's part construction cost. >> Yeah. >> And it is part square footage and size and those sort of things. And maybe I can provide some examples of that, that kind of give you -- give people a sense of what it is and can do that. Downtown, for example, if you're doing high-rise construction, you're not seeing any construction downtown for under $450 a square foot. Tack on land, soft cost, financing, you know, and your costs are, you know, in the upper fives to close to $600 a square foot. It's hard to do affordability under any circumstance at that [11:42:43 AM] level. >> Uh-huh. >> But the other end of it, a typical multifamily project that surfaced is now probably in the $135 a square foot range, and, you know, five years ago that was probably $75 a square foot. So it's been rising dramatically. >> Yeah. >> While incomes for a large portion of our population stays static. That's the challenge. >> And also, waiver of fees is one thing that local government entities could grant in if certain requirements are met. >> The city of Austin is pretty good about that. >> With our S.M.A.R.T. Housing program. >> Right. So it is. But it's a challenge. It's a challenge. And so for me in our business, where we try to provide housing for what I refer to as the masses, but the bulk of our society, where ten years ago we were looking at single-family detached communities that would [11:43:43 AM] maybe average four or five units an acre, we're now looking at attached housing that's 10 to 25 units an acre to try to get that price down, where the average square footage ten years ago was maybe 1500 square feet, today it's going to be less. >> Uh-huh. All right. So lots to talk about still. >> I don't know if two hours is enough. >> Okay. Well, so I guess that's all we have today. Thank you all for being here. We're adjourned at 11:43.